16-bit: The Peoples Choice

[Leon Retro]

All the 16-bit haters are very funny.

I basically began gaming on 16-bit. I looked forward to 32-bit, Virtual Reality, etc....

I wasn't some kid who could only afford one machine - so I didn't become a fanboy of one machine. I had every machine( spoilt ) ..... and I wanted more, much more.

Did 32-bit deliver what I expected? ... No. Most of the games were interesting, because they're in 3D, but after a while, I got used to 3D, and things weren't sooo impressive anymore.

Did Virtual Reality become a reality in the home? ... No. Maybe that would have been something truely amazing - that I would consider better than 16-bit, but it never happened.


I'm not anti anything, except crap games. I wanted 32-bit to deliver what it promised, but it never did. All we got was a lot of experimental 3D experiences - some good, some poor, but none truely brilliant.

Once I got used to 3D gaming - my appreciation for 16-bit 2D, became stronger.

Why would I grow fonder of 16-bit classics - if 32/64/128-bit gaming truely offered more fun and excitement?

The fact is, some people like games like Resident Evil/Metal Gear Solid/Silent Hill/Final Fantasy VII etc.....

I think a lot of gamers felt compelled to buy those games because of the hype which claimed they were "Immersive" ... "Realistic" .... "Stunning" .... but beneath those claims, a lot of gamers found little actual "Fun".

I think ContraSpirits is more fun than Metal Gear Solid. Splatterhouse is a pleasure to play compared to Resident Evil. SuperMarioWorld is wayyyy better than any Jak&Daxter, Spyro The Dragon etc...

Lots of gamers feel the same - not because of nostalgia, but simply because... classic 16-bit games do offer genuine "Fun" .. and no bull****.

It's an insult to keeping branding people "Nostalgia Junkies" ... just because they like pure gameplay, without hassles, and creeky 3D engines, spoiling the fun.

If 32-bit gaming onwards... did deliver experiences that were unquestionably more fun and exciting, then I don't think the retro scene would be as popular, and 8/16-bit gaming wouldn't be voted the best.

The people have spoken. 16-bit gaming has won. Modern gaming isn't as great as some people want to believe. Its not all rosy. That's a fact.

[Team Andromeda]

I've had plenty of fun with Saturn Bomberman , Rally Decathlete . You talk like 16 bit game didn't have a lot of rubbish or games didn't have thier own problems with sprite flicker , slowdown ect

Just becasue they're 2D does not mean they didn't have thier own problems

[Leon Retro]

I've had plenty of fun with Saturn Bomberman , Rally Decathlete . You talk like 16 bit game didn't have a lot of rubbish or games didn't have thier own problems with sprite flicker , slowdown ect

Just becasue they're 2D does not mean they didn't have thier own problems

I always say that I'm talking about the best, AAA, classic 16-bit games.

There was a ton of garbage, mediocre games.

I can't fault my favourtie 16-bit games. MarioWorld/ContraSpirits/CastlevaniaIV/Sonic 1-2-3/Bomberman/MarioKart/F-Zero/GunstarHeroes etc... etc.... All of these are perfect imo. They give me total pleasure - with no headaches.

Then you have all the amazing 16-bit arcade games. The list of great 16-bit games across consoles/computers & arcade, is immense.

At the end of the day, I like to sit down and play games that are straightforward, give me an adrenaline rush, and are visually & sonically effective. That's what 16-bit gaming delivers.

We can go over games that I like for 32/64/128-bit, and the list of games I've enjoyed, is quite long, but I would honestly choose 16-bit, if I could only have one generation of machines.

Gaming could have stopped in 1995 - and I don't think that would have been a bad thing. There is enough gaming gold made between 1980-1995 - to keep any gamer satisfied forever.

I simply don't think 3D, Cinematics, FMV, 5.1 sound, motion sensing etc... have really made gaming any more "Fun".

My overall view is that the industry used to have better designers in all areas ( visuals/sound/game design ) .. before 1995. After that, nearly everything became corporate, and technology led. Games became bigger, more showy, but imagination, flair, and that elusive magic, faded away.

I always say that I feel that Outrun2 was a miracle creation. I can't believe it got made this decade. It's just too happy, well designed, fun to play, and magical, to be a success in today's gaming world; or even feel part of it.

Most games these days are mostly in brown/grey vision, with clunky framerates, glitches, tearing. The way they are designed, is usually headache inducing, because of the many frustrations.

Even when you get fairly decent games like MarioGalaxy, I get the feeling that Nintendo are resting on their laurels, because they feel a unique game engine - and a big dose of familiarity, is enough to satisfy gamers.

I see and hear a lot of hype, but it's usually hollow. I still play 16-bit classics - because I know they deliver true, no bull**** entertainment.

[Team Andromeda]

I always say that I'm talking about the best, AAA, classic 16-bit games.



I can't fault my favourtie 16-bit games. MarioWorld/ContraSpirits/CastlevaniaIV/Sonic 1-2-3/Bomberman/MarioKart/F-Zero/GunstarHeroes etc... etc.... All of these are perfect imo. They give me total pleasure - with no headaches.

Then you have all the amazing 16-bit arcade games. The list of great 16-bit games across consoles/computers & arcade, is immense.

I can fault those games either , but I could list you plenty of pick and play games onthe Saturn that and 2D games were the Saturn real strength . I loved 16 bit , but sometimes the Hardware held back the developer onthe Saturn you had near Arcade pefrect ports of the very best Arcade shooters , and Treasure and SEGA just going to town on 2D.

SEGA Saturn gave users brilliant 3D games and the best 2D one will ever see . Love the system , nothing comes close or ever will


It doesn't come any better than SOUKY

[samanosuke]

I loved 16 bit , but sometimes the Hardware held back the developer onthe Saturn you had near Arcade pefrect ports of the very best Arcade shooters

Dunno about the hardware holding developers back on the 16-bit consoles - do you reckon the Saturn could handle a perfect port of Garou: MotW? Even the Dreamcast couldn't...

[Team Andromeda]

Dunno about the hardware holding developers back on the 16-bit consoles - do you reckon the Saturn could handle a perfect port of Garou: MotW? Even the Dreamcast couldn't...

It pull off a better port than what the 16 bit versions could ever handle, 16 bit machines couldn't handle CP1 ports , Saturn pissed them out near Perfect CP II with ease, only lack of memeory hurt the system . You played the 16bit ports of Samurai Showdown ?, I think its say to say other than playing them onthe Neo Geo (yes I know it's 16 bit) , the Saturn was your next best move , The Snes and MD versions were rubbish

You look at the shooters , there's just not way any 16bit console like the MD or Snes could handle a shooters like Battle Garegga . With PS and Saturn Arcade pefect ports were at last possible

[belmondo]

Dunno about the hardware holding developers back on the 16-bit consoles - do you reckon the Saturn could handle a perfect port of Garou: MotW? Even the Dreamcast couldn't...

Any differences between the NG and DC versions of Garou will be down to the nature of porting games (i.e. you're transferring code to a different system, and generally trying to do as little as possible to get it working). There's no magic inside a Neo Geo that prevents games from being ported accurately to other, more powerful machines.

Memory was definitely the sticking point for 2D on 32 bit machines, I reckon the Saturn could have handled a 'perfect' port of Garou or even SF3 with more RAM.

Back on topic, 16 bit definitely holds a lot of nostalga for me, but I wouldn't say it was my favourite... I like 2D action games, and whilst the best platformers were 16 bit there have been a lot better shooters and fighters since then.

[samanosuke]

It pull off a better port than what the 16 bit versions could ever handle, 16 bit machines couldn't handle CP1 ports , Saturn pissed them out near Perfect CP II with ease, only lack of memeory hurt the system . You played the 16bit ports of Samurai Showdown ?, I think its say to say other than playing them onthe Neo Geo (yes I know it's 16 bit) , the Saturn was your next best move

Nail, meet head.

You champion 32-bit over 16-bit, citing superior arcade conversions but you can't get more arcade perfect than the AES, and it falls into the 16-bit category. You choose to neglect this fact and attack the 16-bit consoles for their apparently poor arcade conversions - I could do the same by saying that the N64 is sh*t at 2D, or that the PSX has awful Capcom/SNK conversions... If you're going to criticise the 16-bit era then at least take all three consoles into consideration when doing so.

[Team Andromeda]

Nail, meet head.

You champion 32-bit over 16-bit, citing superior arcade conversions but you can't get more arcade perfect than the AES, and it falls into the 16-bit category. You choose to neglect this fact and attack the 16-bit consoles for their apparently poor arcade conversions - I could do the same by saying that the N64 is sh*t at 2D, or that the PSX has awful Capcom/SNK conversions... If you're going to criticise the 16-bit era then at least take all three consoles into consideration when doing so.

Of course you can , what about NA@MI ports ? and that falls inthe 128bt market , what about ST-V ports or system 12 ports they were about as Arcade pefect as you could get too .

You'll be right to point out the awful PS ports or how the N64 was sh8t at 2D, I defy you to say that about the SEGA Saturn though.
16 bit shooter port from the Arcade there were always stuff miss, problems with sprite flicker , slowdown or levels completely missing , that wasn't so much case with 32bit Saturn ports , The likes of Darius Gardien , Layerd Section , Battle Garraga were about as Arcade perefct as you could want (look over missing frames) that 16bit Hardware simply couldn't handle not even the Neo Geo.

in my eye's the likes of Guardian Hero , Astal, Magic Nightrayearth are the best looking 2D game around , even with best work from Capcom the 16 bit CP 1 ports were always missing stuff, Saturn CP 1/II were more or less perfect . Sure they were missing frames , but that would be the case with 16bit ports given the limits over cart sizes.

Also with the Saturn I was at last able to play perfect ports of OutRun, Power Drift something would only be a dream on 16 bit consoles - with only the Mega CD having the sort of hardware to handle a port and even then it wouldn't have quite been perfect .

I would say that when it came to platfrom games the 8bit and 16 bit days were and still are the best , I be lying if I made out otherwise

[samanosuke]

16bit Hardware simply couldn't handle not even the Neo Geo.

I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall. Excuse me but in what way does the 16-bit Neo Geo AES not handle Neo Geo games? My point is this: you criticise 16-bit consoles (I assume you mean just the SNES and MD) for their inability to handle perfect arcade ports (even though some ports, Strider for instance, are actually better than the original) but you neglect the fact that we are comparing eras here, not individual consoles. By saying that 16-bit machines cannot handle decent arcade conversions is a lie, as we all know that the AES is the same architecture as MVS arcade hardware.

It seems to me that your argument is Saturn vs MD/SNES. That's not the point of this topic: your argument should be 32/64-bit vs 16-bit (and that includes the AES) consoles.

[12-51-00]

Dunno about the hardware holding developers back on the 16-bit consoles - do you reckon the Saturn could handle a perfect port of Garou: MotW? Even the Dreamcast couldn't...

That's unfair, doesn't the Neo Geo have freakish amounts of ram for a console? or the cartridges do or something? Whatever, the fact is Neo Geo games are built to the Neo Geo's strengths and ports would never be as good. Look at Naomi games on the PS2? Awful yet on DC most are arcade perfect, or at least as near as you'd ever get.

Also Garou: Mark of Wolves came out during the 32-Bit era didn't it? I seriously doubt the Neo Geo could do Daytona, Sega Rally, Tekken 3, or Metal Gear Solid let alone Soul Calibur, Ikaruga, Crazy Taxi, or Shenmue.

I also don't think it's fair to say we're 16-Bit haters. I love Sonic and like I've said before; Super Mario World is THE greatest game ever for my money. You just can't ignore everything else though, the best you can say is that 16-Bit graphics have aged better than 32-Bit.

Moving away from 2D Fighters, something that's a complete niche these days, let's look at Sports, Racing, First-Person Shooters, RPGs, 3D Fighting Games, Adventure/Survival Horror or any of the genres that are still popular/mainstream/selling well these days. Gaming isn't just about one or two cult genres, the mainstream matters.

[Team Andromeda]

I feel like I'm banging my head against a brick wall. Excuse me but in what way does the 16-bit Neo Geo AES not handle Neo Geo games? My point is this: you criticise 16-bit consoles (I assume you mean just the SNES and MD) for their inability to handle perfect arcade ports (even though some ports, Strider for instance, are actually better than the original) but you neglect the fact that we are comparing eras here, not individual consoles. By saying that 16-bit machines cannot handle decent arcade conversions is a lie, as we all know that the AES is the same architecture as MVS arcade hardware.

It seems to me that your argument is Saturn vs MD/SNES. That's not the point of this topic: your argument should be 32/64-bit vs 16-bit (and that includes the AES) consoles.

Strider never looked as good as the Arcade and had stuff like speech missing , The PS port onthe other hand was a perfect port, If its Arcade perfect you want you can't get any more Arcade perfect than Strider onthe PS
I thought the point was about Arcade pefect ports well excuse me if the DC was pretty much King in this aera , as it could not only handle Arcade pefect ports of games running own its Hadware (like that means anything) , but other hardware too like CP II or CP III, Model 2 or even Neo Geo .

This aerra talk is silly too as they were 32bit machines around inthe 16bit day, what with the 3DO, and there were 16 bit machines aorund inthe 8 it days . Neo Geo was fine handling ports of games running own its own Hardware , but then so was the Dreamcast , Saturn , PS any machine/console would

The like of the Saturn/DC had enough power to Emulate other dedicated hardware or Jamma boards something which even 16 bit machines found hard going sometimes . Look at Raiden on pretty much every 16 bit , 8 bit Hardware around at the time , none can touch the PS version if we want to talk Arcade Perfect

Pick and play games, Arcade ports , 2D gaming was alive and well inthe 32bit age too , and in that age we had some of the best looking 2D games ever made too

[Pilotwings]

You could sort of say the 64 wins since it came 1st place

[samanosuke]

This aerra talk is silly too as they were 32bit machines around inthe 16bit day

Ah, I think I see why we have our wires crossed. This thread is a continuation the Desert Island Consoles thread, which asked posters to pick an era of consoles (8-bit, 16-bit, 32/64-bit and 128-bit) that they'd want to take with them to the island. My arguments were based around this premise.

[Team Andromeda]

Ah, I think I see why we have our wires crossed. This thread is a continuation the Desert Island Consoles thread, which asked posters to pick an era of consoles (8-bit, 16-bit, 32/64-bit and 128-bit) that they'd want to take with them to the island. My arguments were based around this premise.

Oh ok thats fair enough , Sorry about that